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| After much personal research, I think I have come up with the cause of lockjaw in puffers and predatory fish that have a history of being fed only or large amounts of freeze dried krill. I have written a preliminary paper and presented my hypothesis to Drs Noga, Lewbart, Stoskopf and Harms at a recent Fish Health Conference. They all seem to think that I am on the "right track" and are willing to do the official research. They are in need of deceased puffers or other predatory fish (lionfish, triggers, groupers, etc). They have to be shipped to NCSU and CAN NOT be frozen. They have to be refrigerated and shipped asap, overnight in a cooler. In addition to the necropsy, they will be doing histiopath and blood work. I will be posting all the shipping info, etc soon....if a fish dies before then, please PM me & I can get the info sooner. Please - let's spread the word and get to the bottom of this horrible condition. My preliminary article will be published soon - I will let all know the magazine/publication date.
Kelly
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Group: Forum Members
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| Can you please tell me if lock jaw is caused by frozen krill also? or is it only the freeze dried? I think my porcupine puffer has lock jaw. Also can you tell me how to force feed him and what to use. thanks much!
laura
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| Welcome to the Marinedepot.com forums. It has been reported in both the freeze dried as well as the frozen....but freezed dried reportings are far more prevalent. How long have you had the puffer? How big is the puffer? Has your puffer eaten anything besides the krill? Frozen or freeze dried? Do you add any supplements or vitamins to food or the tank? What are your water parameters? Can you post a pic of your puffer? There are a few threads in this forum that mention tube (gavage) feeding...search function key in the upper right corner can help you find them. The most recent thread: http://forum.marinedepot.com/Topic81305-10-1.aspx Please keep us updated on your puffer. If the puffer does not make it through this condition - PLEASE contact me so we can get him to the research facility so we can pinpoint the exact cause and hopefully a cure/remedy. Again, welcome. Best of luck.
Kelly
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Group: Forum Members
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Thank you Kelly for your reply. the water was just tested a couple of days ago but I'm sorry I didn't write it down. I do know all was within normal range. Giggles is in a 120gal. fish only tank with a Yellow Tang, a Clown Trigger, a Luna Wrasse, a Flame Hawkfish, a Spanish Hogfish and two Maroon Clowns. I feed at least six different frozen foods on a daily basis. Krill, mega marine, chopped clams, squid, mysis shrimp,and spirulina. The problem is, Giggles dosen't eat anything but the krill and I didn't know it was bad for him. He went from being a voracious eater one day to nothing the next. He chases after the food but can't seem to grab it. His symptoms are a carbon copy of what others are describing in their fish with lock jaw. I also add Vita Chem and garlic cloves to the tank. I would say he was around five or six inches long and I've had him about six months and I just adore him. Plus, I have the tank at my dog grooming salon and the clients love him too. He's becoming sort of a mascot and he flirts with everybody. One thing I'm not sure of though Kelly is that I can see him opening his lips. When he knows it's time to eat or when he's hungry he wiggles back and forth and opens and closes his mouth like a baby bird but when I put the food in he can't seem to grab it. Besides adding extra Vita Chem to the tank I also added a Iodine/Iodide supplement for corals. I read that lock jaw was caused by a B12 and iodine deficiancy. I hope I've answered all your questions. I'm going to check the tube feeding links. Thanks much, Laura
laura
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topdogofca (7/5/2008)
Thank you Kelly for your reply. the water was just tested a couple of days ago but I'm sorry I didn't write it down. I do know all was within normal range. Giggles is in a 120gal. fish only tank with a Yellow Tang, a Clown Trigger, a Luna Wrasse, a Flame Hawkfish, a Spanish Hogfish and two Maroon Clowns. I feed at least six different frozen foods on a daily basis. Krill, mega marine, chopped clams, squid, mysis shrimp,and spirulina. The problem is, Giggles dosen't eat anything but the krill and I didn't know it was bad for him. He went from being a voracious eater one day to nothing the next. He chases after the food but can't seem to grab it. His symptoms are a carbon copy of what others are describing in their fish with lock jaw. I also add Vita Chem and garlic cloves to the tank. I would say he was around five or six inches long and I've had him about six months and I just adore him. Plus, I have the tank at my dog grooming salon and the clients love him too. He's becoming sort of a mascot and he flirts with everybody. One thing I'm not sure of though Kelly is that I can see him opening his lips. When he knows it's time to eat or when he's hungry he wiggles back and forth and opens and closes his mouth like a baby bird but when I put the food in he can't seem to grab it.The inability to masticate (chew) is also associated with this krill induced state. Besides adding extra Vita Chem to the tank I also added a Iodine/Iodide supplement for corals. I read that lock jaw was caused by a B12 and iodine deficiancy. I hope I've answered all your questions. I'm going to check the tube feeding links. Thanks much, Laura Where did you read about the iodine deficiency causing lockjaw. The problem with this belief is that krill is high in iodine. Freeze drying or freezing does not alter the iodine content. The fish that has been submitted for necropsy did not have a low iodine level. Please keep us updated.
Kelly
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Hi Kelly, I read about the Iodine on the Puffer Forum. I went back and reread it and I must be misunderstanding what they're trying to say? Are you familiar with it? Your name is mentioned as THE person to ask. I found that website before I found this one.
laura
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topdogofca (7/6/2008)
Hi Kelly, I read about the Iodine on the Puffer Forum. I went back and reread it and I must be misunderstanding what they're trying to say? Are you familiar with it? Your name is mentioned as THE person to ask. I found that website before I found this one.I figured that is where you saw it......again, there is no research, no water parameters reported, etc. This is one of the most frustrating things about the internet and forums. Again, best of luck and please keep us updated.
Kelly
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| I have the same problem, my dogface puffer only eats Freeze Dried Krill, the LFS had been feeding it to him, now I cant get him off it. (Ive only had him for a week, dont know how long hes been on it) Tried Squid, Brine, Mysis. How do you transition off this?? I use Garlic. Ive even tried soft pellets that are krill flavored. Some people told me to get clams, fish, from the grocery store but no store sells fresh fish where I live, only frozen shrimp in the freezers. I thought of getting lots of snails, but I would like to supplement his diet with the squid, etc that everything else in the tank eats too.
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| Frozen shrimp at your local grocery store is okay. Make sure it is not cooked and feed with the shell on. You can also try frozen ProSalt prawn (on-line or LFS), PE mysis shrimp, frozen squid (grocery stores or Asian markets). Scallops (frozen at the grocery store) is another favorite of puffers. Please keep us updated. Best of luck.
Kelly
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Puffer Queen (8/5/2008)
Frozen shrimp at your local grocery store is okay. Make sure it is not cooked and feed with the shell on. You can also try frozen ProSalt prawn (on-line or LFS), PE mysis shrimp, frozen squid (grocery stores or Asian markets). Scallops (frozen at the grocery store) is another favorite of puffers. Please keep us updated. Best of luck. I found a package of crab legs, octopus, squid, shrimp fresh at the local grocery store. I purchased it for now and he loves it, esp. the octopus! I completly took the krill away and he doesnt seem to care. the only thing is the fish is already cooked, is this unhealthy?
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